In Conversation: Lucius

For two decades, gifted vocalists and songwriters Jess Wolfe and Holly Laessig have worked side-by-side. While the 60s-soaked, indie-pop shimmer of their band Lucius has remained their primary interest, it hasn’t been their sole focus. They’ve built a jaw-dropping list of extracurricular collaborations that reads like a Who’s Who of music legends, featuring the likes of Joni Mitchell, Jackson Browne, and Mavis Staples. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg. 

Perhaps their most significant excursion has been with Pink Floyd co-founder and perennial political rabble-rouser, Roger Waters. The duo appeared on Waters’ 2017 solo album ‘Is This the Life We Really Want?‘ and joined his backing band on his acclaimed Us + Them world tour, charged with the responsibility of replicating Clare Torry’s famous – and famously daunting – pirouetting vocal on ‘The Great Gig in the Sky’ from ‘The Dark Side of the Moon’.

Speaking backstage at All Points East, Wolfe, in the company of Laessig, talked of Lucius’ return, their decision to part ways with Waters (for now), and what twenty years in an ever-changing music industry has given them. 

“I’d rather focus on making a record that people will want to listen to forever than write a song with the aim of taking off on TikTok,” Wolfe tells CLASH.

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Your new single, ‘Old Tape’, features The War on Drugs’s Adam Granduciel. How did the collaboration come about? 

Jess Wolfe: This song felt very conducive to Adam’s musical world when we were writing it. We’d sung on the track ‘I Don’t Live Here Anymore’ on his last record and this felt like our response to that. He’s such a dear friend and we felt that ‘Old Tape’ honoured Adam in some way. Luckily, he loved it and jumped right in!

Have you noticed a change in how you write over the years? Has the dynamic between you and Holly changed at all?

JW: Definitely. It’s inevitable that when you collaborate with so many different people your musical world and your artistic imagination opens up. When the two of us go into a room now we have a huge suitcase full of musical ideas to draw from because of those experiences. We’ve also been singing together for twenty years. What’s wonderful about that is we know each other so well. We’re able to tap into each other’s experiences because we’ve been a witness to one another’s lives.

What’s the biggest education you’ve had from being guest vocalists on other people’s records? 

JW: Well, oftentimes, people just want to hear us do our own arrangements and add what it is that Lucius can add to their track. And we’re very, very fortunate in that way. That said, we’ve learned from literally everyone we’ve worked with because everyone has a different perspective. For example, Sheryl Crow and Roger Waters couldn’t be more different from one another, but we’ve equally been inspired by, and taken from, both. Obviously, we’ve spent a lot more time with Roger. 

What did the experience with Roger Waters give you? 

JW: He’s the one that we are most inspired by visually because every moment of his show is so thought-out, creative and beautiful. Roger has the means to do whatever he wants, so he lets his mind roam with ideas and then puts them to use, and we all get to witness and appreciate that. He’s the inventor of rock and roll theatre, I would say.

To have amassed the number of collaborations that you have whilst keeping Lucius going and not lose your identity is quite a feat. 

JW: Yeah. It’s taken a lot of intention and purpose. We could have kept going on Roger’s tours. We are dear friends, and he was so good to us. He wanted us to continue. But we had to tend to our own thing, otherwise, we could’ve gotten lost in someone else’s musical world. It is a beautiful musical world, but it is nonetheless someone else’s. 

Was it nevertheless a difficult decision to part ways? 

JW: Yes, but also very clear. We had three years with him [before the pandemic], and then it was lockdown. In the end, it was a long time being away from our own thing – so, it was time. We were ready to be back in our own band. Our shows are clearly much smaller than his but, even so, having your own audience singing along to your songs, there’s nothing that beats it, even if it’s 500 people and not 50,000.

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The industry has changed so much since you first emerged. What’s it been like to be a part of this in real-time, as these shifting sands occur? Especially when it comes to the rise of social media.

JW: I feel like I need a lesson from an 18-year-old! It’s hard for me to get on board with it. Not because of a lack of want, necessarily, it’s just that it takes up so much time and energy. I’m focused on other things, I guess, so I feel a little out of the loop. Maybe that’s a sign of age – I hope it’s not, because there are lots of people in every age group who are finding ways to express themselves through these new mediums. I want us to do the same. I just haven’t found out how yet!

There’s a sense that some artists are writing with the sole purpose of going viral on, say, TikTok. That might sound cynical, but it’s hard to deny that it’s occurring in some quarters. How do you feel about that side of things?

JW: If you write with that as your motive, I believe that most of the time people can tell. You can’t really cheat people, because it comes through. And I’d rather build a career that’s everlasting – one that comes from a genuine place. That means writing the best songs for us, and if, say, a viral moment ever happened to us, I’d like to think it’s because it was meant to happen. Also, at the end of the day, we’re all still listening to The Beatles; we’re all still listening to the Stones. 

We resort to the songs that have made an imprint on our lives. I don’t think that’s going to change. In the grand scheme of things, I’d rather focus on making a record that people will want to listen to forever than write a song with the aim of taking off on TikTok.

How close are you to finishing album number five?

JW: We’re almost done! ‘Old Tape’ is out, and we just finished the album’s order. It’s being mastered, and we’re really pumped about it!

Are there any other guests on the album?

JW: There’s one other guest: Madison Cunningham. She’s an incredible writer, singer, and guitar player. She’s just ridiculously talented.

Sonically, does the album follow a similar path to ‘Old Tape’? 

JW: Yes. ‘Old Tape’ is a bit of an anchor for the record. Pete [Lalish – guitar], Danny [Molad – drums], Holly and I have been working together for a long time now, so the four of us decided to produce this record ourselves. It feels like we’re returning to who we are again.

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